Spike season 7 ramblings

C

Ciara

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Hi
I was just rewatching the beginning of series 7 and I was just thinking that Spike's rambling sounded a bit Shakespearian? Maybe that's just because Joss always expresses a love for Shakespeare that I'm influenced, but the language just sounded sort of old timey and sort of a mix of making sense/not making sense like Shakespeare does (to the untrained mind like mine!).
Anyway just wondered if anyone else had noticed anything or I'm just imagining.
Thanks!
 
I think that Spike, in his semi-deranged state at the beginning of Season 7, was just about as close to being just plain William again than he ever had been before, probably because of the general shock of having his human soul restored. William, as human was undoubtedly a student and lover of classic literature, including, of course, Shakespeare. It's understandable that, in his then state of mind, all of that would come back to him.
 
white avenger said:
I think that Spike, in his semi-deranged state at the beginning of Season 7, was just about as close to being just plain William again than he ever had been before, probably because of the general shock of having his human soul restored. William, as human was undoubtedly a student and lover of classic literature, including, of course, Shakespeare. It's understandable that, in his then state of mind, all of that would come back to him.
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i hadnt thought of this before, but i definitely like the idea and it makes sense.
 
Spike has quoted Shakespeare before with his "I'll chop them into messes" line and spoofed it with his "we band of buggered" line. Spike knows Shakespeare.

I agree though with @white avenger that Spike was as close to William as he'd ever been since his siring. It's a shame the human WIlliam's soul was pulled out of whatever happy place it resided in and forced to endure what Spike endured in season 7.
 
Yeah that sounds totally logical, nice one. I think I read that a deleted line from one of spikes rambles was some ofWilliam's poetry so that made sense.
 
From "Chosen" at the end of Season 5:

BUFFY
Willow, stay close but don't crowd her.
We'll follow in a minute. Everyone
knows their jobs. Remember, the ritual
starts, we all die. And I'll kill anyone
who comes near Dawn.

She moves off toward the basement. The others gather weapons as Willow heads out the door.

ANGLE: SPIKE AND GILES

As Spike is handing over some of his weaponry to Giles, who bags it.

SPIKE
Not exactly the St. Crispin's Day
speech, was it?

GILES
(sardonic agreement)
"We few..."


GILES/SPIKE
"we happy few…"


SPIKE
"We band of buggered..."

This was taken from Act IV of Shakespeare's Henry V exhorting his men to fight the French in 1415 when they were outmanned. Westmoreland (who was not in historical fact at the battle) is concerned about how few soldiers the English have. The king spoke of the honour they would have as long as they live after fighting this battle:

WESTMORELAND

O that we now had here
But one ten thousand of those men in England
That do no work to-day!

KING

What's he that wishes so?
My cousin, Westmoreland? No, my fair cousin;
If we are mark'd to die, we are enow
To do our country loss; and if to live,
The fewer men, the greater share of honour.
God's will! I pray thee, wish not one man more.
By Jove, I am not covetous for gold,
Nor care I who doth feed upon my cost;
It yearns me not if men my garments wear;
Such outward things dwell not in my desires.
But if it be a sin to covet honour,
I am the most offending soul alive.
No, faith, my coz, wish not a man from England.
God's peace! I would not lose so great an honour
As one man more methinks would share from me
For the best hope I have. O, do not wish one more!
Rather proclaim it, Westmoreland, through my host,
That he which hath no stomach to this fight,
Let him depart; his passport shall be made,
And crowns for convoy put into his purse;
We would not die in that man's company
That fears his fellowship to die with us.
This day is call'd the feast of Crispian.
He that outlives this day, and comes safe home,
Will stand a tip-toe when this day is nam'd,
And rouse him at the name of Crispian.
He that shall live this day, and see old age,
Will yearly on the vigil feast his neighbours,
And say "To-morrow is Saint Crispian."
Then will he strip his sleeve and show his scars,
And say "These wounds I had on Crispin's day."
Old men forget; yet all shall be forgot,
But he'll remember, with advantages,
What feats he did that day. Then shall our names,
Familiar in his mouth as household words—
Harry the King, Bedford and Exeter,
Warwick and Talbot, Salisbury and Gloucester—
Be in their flowing cups freshly rememb'red.
This story shall the good man teach his son;
And Crispin Crispian shall ne'er go by,
From this day to the ending of the world,
But we in it shall be remembered-
We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother; be he ne'er so vile,
This day shall gentle his condition;
And gentlemen in England now a-bed
Shall think themselves accurs'd they were not here,
And hold their manhoods cheap whiles any speaks
That fought with us upon Saint Crispin's day.

Both Giles and Spike were familiar with the St. Crispin's Day speech from their education in English literature. I am not surprised that Spike, who had dedicated himself to writing poetry before he was sired, would be familiar with Shakespearean writings that were written in Early Modern English. His ramblings at the beginning of Season 7 would come from the memory of William Pratt, his name before being sired, and he could be expected to revert to the English of Elizabethan times.
 
DeadlyDuo said:
Spike has quoted Shakespeare before with his "I'll chop them into messes" line and spoofed it with his "we band of buggered" line. Spike knows Shakespeare.

I agree though with @white avenger that Spike was as close to William as he'd ever been since his siring. It's a shame the human WIlliam's soul was pulled out of whatever happy place it resided in and forced to endure what Spike endured in season 7.
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Yeah since he was a poet and is a romantic it makes sense that he knows shakespeare. It seems that Dru knows shakespeare too because her line about loving well but not wisely is a paraphrase from shakespeares play othello which is where the chopped into messes line is also from. "Then must you speak of one who loved not wisely but too well" is the line from the play. Its interesting to consider why whedon chose that play to paraphrase from for those two scenes and for those two characters to paraphrase.
 
Slayerofslayers said:
Yeah since he was a poet and is a romantic it makes sense that he knows shakespeare. It seems that Dru knows shakespeare too because her line about loving well but not wisely is a paraphrase from shakespeares play othello which is where the chopped into messes line is also from. "Then must you speak of one who loved not wisely but too well" is the line from the play. Its interesting to consider why whedon chose that play to paraphrase from for those two scenes and for those two characters to paraphrase.
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I'm just imagining Spike and Dru going to the theatre to watch some performances of Shakespeare. 20 years later and we've just discovered a new layer to the couple. 😛
 
DeadlyDuo said:
I'm just imagining Spike and Dru going to the theatre to watch some performances of Shakespeare. 20 years later and we've just discovered a new layer to the couple. 😛
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Now I'm getting fan fic ideas for that lol. Maybe thats why Spike said that line to Dru when she asked him to kill Buffy for her because she is fond of shakespeare too and they may have seen some performances of Shakespeare together so he knew by saying that as his confirmation that he was going to do that for her that it would put her mind at ease since she was upset about it. Hence her smile and her response of "You are my sweet. My little Spike." (just a fun head canon who knows if thats why he said that particular line at that moment lol). And yeah their relationship has many layers thats what makes them such a great couple and being together for a hundred years leaves a lot to be discovered about them. 🙂 Plus the writers hardly showed us any of their time together so a lot of their relationship is unknown.
 
Slayerofslayers said:
Now I'm getting fan fic ideas for that lol. Maybe thats why Spike said that line to Dru when she asked him to kill Buffy for her because she is fond of shakespeare too and they may have seen some performances of Shakespeare together so he knew by saying that as his confirmation that he was going to do that for her that it would put her mind at ease since she was upset about it. Hence her smile and her response of "You are my sweet. My little Spike." (just a fun head canon who knows if thats why he said that particular line at that moment lol). And yeah their relationship has many layers thats what makes them such a great couple and being together for a hundred years leaves a lot to be discovered about them. 🙂 Plus the writers hardly showed us any of their time together so a lot of their relationship is unknown.
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That makes a lot of sense and the little look he gives her when he says it just seems like he knows it's a reference she'd like.
 
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